THE ABSURD TIMES
Revolution, Brand, and Voting
Illustration: From Whatnowtunes.com by Kieth Tucker. We haven't been able to use his work in some time as he is focused on internal matters. In addition, I have trouble contacting the site or even providing a link. There is one in the sidebar, however.
We have plenty of zealots telling us
sanctimoniously about
the importance of voting. Certainly,
if
Gore had beaten Bush back in his first election, we would not be
faced with
such an onerous Supreme Court, and to that extent, we can agree. We must point out, however,
that with the
current system such as it is, we will never see another William O.
Douglas
appointed, no matter who is President.
There are some subtle differences between the
parties,
granted. For example, we
would never
see an Affordable Health Care Act from a Republican (emasculated
as it became
in Congress to the point of being almost worthless) and we
probably would have
seen much more military action with a Republican President.
Beyond that, until some sort of funding limits
are imposed
(which out Supreme Court would not allow) or Public Funding (yeah,
right), we
will never see even a semi-democratic government. Sure, a Socialist Party is allowed, so long as
they are not
successful. The Tea
Party, pardon the
expression, actually started out as a populist movement, but was
soon taken
over by hugely rich and oligarchic powers and the "populace"
involved
became very stupid, saying things like "Keep your government hands
off my
Social Security." No,
other
parties with real agendas are simply not allowed. An extremely old joke sums it up with an old
woman saying "I
never vote because it just encourages them."
Before I go on, a personal note: I recently had
a back
strain and had to use a cane for the time being. Today I was shopping when my way was blocked by
the most
hideously ugly, rotund, woman I've seen in a long time. She also made use of her
overloaded shopping
cart to block the entire way. When
I
approached, she stared at me, viciously, as if to say "What ya
goin to do
about it?" Now, I at
least have
very good hand eye coordination and was able to toss the cane
upwards and grab
it, then draw it backward as if I meant to use it, and perhaps I
would have as
I was in some pain at the moment.
She moved
aside very quickly. Moral? Sometimes, if you look
insane and threaten
force, people will get out of your way.
I intend to keep carrying a cane for some time. So now that the humor is set, we will move on.
At any rate, we usually feature writings by
highly educated
scholars and near philosophers of political reality, but here we
have a
self-educated man remarking on revolution in general. At times he seemed a bit hyper and over-defensive
towards the
host, perhaps not knowing who she was, or having heard some rumor
about her
reaction to one of Chomsky's remarks about her father (I know
nothing about
this, but on the whole, it was an excellent interview and
analysis:
FRIDAY,
NOVEMBER
14, 2014
Russell Brand on Revolution, Fighting Inequality, Addiction, Militarized Policing & Noam Chomsky
21,679
SHARED
For years Russell Brand has
been one of
Britain’s most popular comedians, but over the past 12 months he
has also
emerged as a leading voice of Britain’s political left. He has
taken part in
anti-austerity protests, spoken at Occupy Wall Street protests
and marched with
the hacker collective Anonymous. A recovering addict himself,
Brand has also
become a leading critic of Britain’s drug laws. He has just come
out with a new
book expanding on his critique of the political system. It is
simply titled
"Revolution."
TRANSCRIPT
This is a rush transcript.
Copy may not be in
its final form.
AMY GOODMAN: Today, we’re broadcasting from London, and
we’re joined by
Russell Brand. Up until last year, Russell Brand was best known
for being one
of the most popular comedians here in Britain. His résumé
includes hosting the
reality TV show Big
Brother’s
Big Mouth, a stint as a BBC radio host
and starring roles in the films St.
Trinian’s, Forgetting
Sarah
Marshall and Get Him to the Greek.
He also
hosted the MTV Movie
Awards.
But in recent years, Russell
Brand has emerged
as one of the most prominent voices of the British left. He has
taken part in
anti-austerity protests, spoken at Occupy Wall Street and
marched with the hacker
collective Anonymous. A recovering addict himself, Russell Brand
has also
become a leading critic of Britain’s drug laws.
Last year, he guest-edited the New Statesman,
a political
and current affairs magazine here in Britain. The issue included
cover art by
Shepard Fairey and articles by Noam Chomsky, Naomi Klein, among
many others.
He then appeared on BBC Newsnight in an interview with the
well-known BBC host
Jeremy Paxman. The video became a
YouTube sensation.
JEREMY PAXMAN: Is it true you don’t even vote?
RUSSELL BRAND: Yeah, no, I don’t vote.
JEREMY PAXMAN: Well, how do you have any authority to talk
about politics
then?
RUSSELL BRAND: Well, I don’t get my authority from this
pre-existing
paradigm which is quite narrow and only serves a few people. I
look elsewhere
for alternatives that might be of service to humanity.
Alternative means
alternative political systems.
JEREMY PAXMAN: They being?
RUSSELL BRAND: Well, I’ve not invented it yet, Jeremy. I
had to do a
magazine last week. I’ve had a lot on my plate. But I say—but
here’s the thing
that you shouldn’t do: shouldn’t destroy the planet, shouldn’t
create massive
economic disparity, shouldn’t ignore the needs of the people.
The burden of
proof is on the people with the power, not people who like doing
a magazine for
a novelty.
JEREMY PAXMAN: How do you imagine that people get power?
RUSSELL BRAND: Well, I imagine there are sort of
hierarchical systems
that have been preserved through generations—
JEREMY PAXMAN: They get power by being voted in. That’s
how they get it.
RUSSELL BRAND: Well, you say that, Jeremy, but like—
JEREMY PAXMAN: You can’t even be asked to vote.
RUSSELL BRAND: It’s quite narrow—quite a narrow
prescriptive parameter
that changes within the—
JEREMY PAXMAN: In a democracy, that’s how it works.
RUSSELL BRAND: Well, I don’t think it’s working very well,
Jeremy, given
that the planet is being destroyed, given that there is economic
disparity of a
huge degree. What you’re saying, there’s no alternative. There’s
no
alternative, just this system.
JEREMY PAXMAN: No, I’m not saying that. I’m saying—
RUSSELL BRAND: Brilliant.
JEREMY PAXMAN: —if you can’t be asked to vote, why should
we be asked to
listen to your political point of view?
RUSSELL BRAND: You don’t have to listen to my political
point of view.
But it’s not that I’m not voting out of apathy. I’m not voting
out of absolute
indifference and weariness and exhaustion from the lies,
treachery, deceit of
the political class that has been going on for generations now
and which has
now reached fever pitch, where we have a disenfranchised,
disillusioned,
despondent underclass that are not being represented by that
political system.
So, voting for it is tacit complicity with that system, and
that’s not
something I’m offering up.
JEREMY PAXMAN: Why don’t you change it then?
RUSSELL BRAND: I’m trying to.
JEREMY PAXMAN: Well, why don’t you start by voting?
RUSSELL BRAND: I don’t think it works. People have voted
already, and
that’s what’s created the current paradigm.
JEREMY PAXMAN: Well, when did you last vote?
RUSSELL BRAND: Never.
JEREMY PAXMAN: You’ve never, ever voted?
RUSSELL BRAND: No. Do you think that’s really bad?
JEREMY PAXMAN: So, you’ve struck an attitude, what? Before
the age of 18?
RUSSELL BRAND: Well, I was busy being a drug addict at
that point,
because I come from the kind of social conditions that are
exacerbated by an
indifferent system that really just administrates for large
corporations and
ignores the population that it was voted in to serve.
JEREMY PAXMAN: But you’re veiling the—you’re blaming the
political class
for the fact that you had a drug problem?
RUSSELL BRAND: No, no, no. I’m saying I was part of a
social and economic
class that is underserved by the current political system, and
drug addiction
is one of the problems it creates. When you have huge
underserved, impoverished
populations, people get drug problems and also don’t feel like
they want to
engage with the current political system, because they see that
it doesn’t work
for them. They see that it makes no difference. They see that
they’re not
served. I say that the apathy—
JEREMY PAXMAN: But of course it doesn’t work for them if
they don’t
bother to vote.
RUSSELL BRAND: Jeremy, my darling, I’m not saying that—the
apathy doesn’t
come from us, the people. The apathy comes from the politicians.
They are
apathetic to our needs. They’re only interested in servicing the
needs of
corporations. Look at where—ain’t the Tories going to court,
taking the EU to
court? It’s because they’re trying to curtail bank bonuses. Is
that what’s
happening at the moment in our country?
AMY GOODMAN: That was Russell Brand being interviewed on BBC Newsnight by host Jeremy Paxman
last year. Since
it was posted online, more than 10 million people have watched
the video. Well,
Russell Brand has come out with a new book expanding on his
critique of the
political system. It’s called Revolution.
When we come back from break, he’ll be sitting right here in
front of Big Ben.
Stay with us.
[break]
AMY GOODMAN: We are broadcasting from London. We’re just
in front of
Big Ben and also MI5, the British domestic intelligence service.
And our guest
has now turned around to look out the window to say, "Which one
is
MI5?" It’s the low building, Russell.
RUSSELL BRAND: It’s a secret. You’re not supposed to know
that.
AMY GOODMAN: Russell Brand is our guest, Russell Brand
who’s well known
as a comedian and an actor, and also become a leading figure on
the British
left and has a new book out. It’s called, simply, Revolution.
Russell,
welcome to Democracy
Now! It’s
great to have you with us. And
even though there are a lot of obscenities in the world, please
don’t use them
on Democracy Now!today,
or
our stations will be taken off the air.
RUSSELL BRAND: You’re really concerned about that. Did
they say,
"Just say it to him on air"? Honestly, I don’t swear very often.
This
evening, I’m performing at the Royal Albert Hall, London, before
an audience of
children. I won’t swear, I promise. You’re perfectly safe.
AMY GOODMAN: Well, there are children who are listening
and watching
right now. There are adults. There are senior citizens.
RUSSELL BRAND: Stop worrying about it. I won’t swear. What
do you need to
know, Amy? There won’t be any swearing.
AMY GOODMAN: I need to know where you were born.
RUSSELL BRAND: Grays, Essex, where people do use
obscenities a lot, as
would anyone suffering under such dreadful conditions. If
continue down the
Thames in that direction, you will end up at Grays, and you’ll
swim back rather
than stay there. You’d rather live in the MI5 building.
AMY GOODMAN: So, talk about Grays. Talk about where you
were born,
Russell.
RUSSELL BRAND: Where I’m from is a suburban town with low
expectations.
So people in America understand, it’s a bit like Camden, New
Jersey—low
expectations, really, really cool people, fantastic people, but
a kind of place
where it’s difficult to engage with hope, where it’s easy to
imagine that your
life can just sort of trundle out like this low, grey River
Thames.
AMY GOODMAN: Camden is one of the poorest places in the
United States.
RUSSELL BRAND: Oh, it might be a bit better than that,
then. It’s not one
of the poorest places; it’s just not that nice. And growing up
there, I think
it sort of—I’ve had cause to reflect. I wondered why it was that
I was so
attracted to the idea of being so famous and living a sort of
glamorous life
and going to sequin-covered events and being in sparkly places
with
superficially attractive things. I think I put a lot of it down
to the sort of
mundanity of my early life. What was surprising when I went back
there recently
is, even though it was kind of ordinary to begin with and
somewhat economically
deprived, when I went back there recently, it had become much,
much worse—like
the sort of dodgy shops, payday loans, people living on welfare.
And it really
was the inspiration in the writing of the book to see how the
place where I
come from had deteriorated and where that money has gone, where
those resources
have gone, and why people don’t seem to think that they have any
political
purchase or any ability to change the situation.
AMY GOODMAN: So, you were talking about this with Jeremy
Paxman, the
clip we just played that went totally viral, from BBC Newsnight,
where you talked
about why you don’t vote. Now, that was a few years ago. Have
you started voting?
RUSSELL BRAND: One year, I think.
AMY GOODMAN: Have you voted since then?
RUSSELL BRAND: No.
AMY GOODMAN: Do you think the system is changing at all?
RUSSELL BRAND: Do you?
AMY GOODMAN: Well, I don’t live here.
RUSSELL BRAND: I think this is an international problem.
You’ve just had
the American midterm elections, in which $4 billion was spent on
the
campaigning, when we’re told there’s not enough money to deal
with what would
seem to me to be more—like, you know, it was interesting
recently, you know,
like that FEMA,
that U.S. agency that lent out money to people who were victims
of Katrina and
Sandy. They wanted their money back that they lent to people
that had suffered
in those hurricanes. And this is simultaneously, $4 billion has
been spent on
campaigning in midterm elections. And, like, we live in a system
where tax
breaks and tax avoidance are easy if you understand the law. So,
the degree of
systemic change required is so significant, I don’t see any
point in voting for
it. But no one’s saying, "We will do something about that."
AMY GOODMAN: Russell, this gives me a chance to go to
your show, called The
Trews. And—
RUSSELL BRAND: Yeah, The
Trews is my TV
show that I
made with Gareth. It’s not on the television; it’s on the
Internet.
AMY GOODMAN: So it’s a combo between "truth" and "the
news"?
RUSSELL BRAND: It’s one of the cleverest puns in human
history.
AMY GOODMAN: So, you talk about this issue of disabled
and elderly
residents in a assisted living center in Rockaway, New York—this
is after Sandy,
after Superstorm Sandy—being asked to return aid to FEMA,
the
Federal Emergency Management Agency. Let’s go to that clip from The Trews.
RUSSELL BRAND: "Can we have our money back?" "But the
hurricane, disabled." "Money back."
FEMA AID RECIPIENT: I asked them, "Do we have to pay this
back?" And
they said, "No, it’s a gift from the president."
RUSSELL BRAND: "You know that gift I gave you?" "Yes, we
all appreciated it." "Mmm, that makes it a little bit harder to
say
what I’m about to say." "Oh, what is it?" "Give it
back."
AMY GOODMAN: There it is.
RUSSELL BRAND: I’m proud of The
Trews because
what it does
is it gives us an opportunity to provide an alternative news
narrative. What
I’ve noticed since I’ve come in this sphere of public debate
talking about
politics, which I do in my book with, like, input from
insightful and brilliant
figures such as Naomi Klein, Noam Chomsky, that, like, it’s sort
of like people
are having a go at me, like I’m not allowed to participate. You
know,
"Shut up! Look at your hair! Listen to your accent! Be quiet!"
It’s
like a really sort of fiercely guarded, like, realm—not just
from the right,
but from the left, as well. If you sort of go, "Hey, I’m
actually from a
background where people are affected by stuff like this. This is
what we think.
Can we talk about this in a different way?" people are so
fiercely
territorial and protective, it’s interesting. And it’s not
difficult to see why
there is such political stasis and such immobility, because
people don’t
welcome new debate. Not ordinary people. Ordinary people like
it. Ordinary
people are engaged and excited. But I would say there’s a kind
of circuitous
establishment that’s interested in a kind of peculiar circle
jerk of exchanging
opinions.
AMY GOODMAN: Explain what you did at Occupy Democracy
and what it is,
what it is here in Britain.
RUSSELL BRAND: Well, Occupy—the Occupy movement is a
leaderless,
decentralized campaign movement, so it’s the same in the U.K. as
it is in
America. There were a group of protesters occupying Parliament
Square, a
coalition of groups interested in issues such as, like, you
know, fracking,
animal rights, but primarily our inability to have any political
purchase
through democratic process, like that voting doesn’t make any
difference. No
one’s interested in presenting alternatives to draconian,
restrictive trade
agreements, whether they be European or TransAtlantic. And we
have no—and these
are the rules and regulations that affect people’s ordinary
life. And so, I
suppose something like Occupy Democracy is people venting that
frustration and
demonstrating their belief that there’s a need for change.
So I
support that,
because what I reckon is important, and what I talk about in my
book, Amy, is
that creative, local direct action is the answer, that we
shouldn’t be looking
for sort of glamorous new figures to lead us. We shouldn’t be
looking to
conventional politics. It’s not going to provide any answers to
people, like
the women of the New Era Estate in Great Britain, who were being
evicted from their
homes because their areas got trendy now, so all of the rents
have gone up.
These people were going to be evicted from their homes. They
organized
themselves. They campaigned. And now Richard Benyon, MP, the
wealthiest
politician in the houses of Parliament there, has packed his
bags and run from
the confrontation. But still, the Westbrook group, the
developers that own 90
percent of the estate, still have to be confronted. Still, Boris
Johnson, the
mayor of London, has to be confronted, because, you know, it’s
difficult to get
any political purchase. There are no political figures that are
interested in
representing ordinary people.
AMY GOODMAN: Might you run for mayor of London?
RUSSELL BRAND: I don’t think I would really want to be
part of that political
system. What I’m interested in is ordinary people being engaged,
whether it’s
for union activity in their workplaces, new coalitions or people
that are
taking control of the places that they live, Amy.
AMY GOODMAN: You have talked a lot about the power of
corporations and
also materialism.
RUSSELL BRAND: How come you’re allowed a glass, and mine’s
plastic? Why
am I not trusted?
AMY GOODMAN: You can have mine.
RUSSELL BRAND: Why am I having so many warnings about
swearing? You get
glass; I get plastic. This is America versus England, isn’t it?
You’ve nicked
our language. You’ve thrown our flag away, rejected our queen.
And now you’re
taking all the glassware. Come on!
AMY GOODMAN: Thank you, Russell.
RUSSELL BRAND: Cheers! To freedom.
AMY GOODMAN: Corporate culture and materialism—I mean, I
want to talk
about your book, because you talk about the kind of revolution
you want to see.
Talk about the revolutions in your own life, how you’ve changed
over time.
RUSSELL BRAND: Well, the reason I have such faith in the
capacity for
change, for people to change their lives, is because my own life
has changed
radically. All a revolution is, really, is to create structures
outside of the
existing structures, to create change without using the
sanctioned means for change.
And me, I’ve gone from a life of being impoverished and
drug-addicted to a life
where I’m sort of affluent and free from drugs. So, that’s what
gives me this
belief that change is possible on an individual level.
AMY GOODMAN: Talk about how you beat addiction.
RUSSELL BRAND: I don’t know that I beat addiction. One day
at a time, I
surrender to the fact that I am a drug addict. And with the help
and support of
other drug addicts and the belief in a higher power, I’m able to
get daily
reprieve from drugs, that is contingent on me being available to
help other
people with the disease of addiction, taking advice from people
that have got
more time than me, offering help to those that have got less.
And I
think it’s an
important issue, because I think that actually drug addiction is
people—like,
the reason people are addicted to drugs is because there’s sort
of a deficit of
happiness, a deficit of community, a deficit of connection.
Joseph Campbell
talked about our problems being due the lack of a communal myth.
I think all of
us feel a little bit—or a lot of us feel a little adrift, that
we don’t know
how we’re supposed to live, we don’t know what we’re supposed to
do. And in the
end, some kind of anesthetic becomes attractive. Certainly
that’s my personal experience.
I recognize now that the thing that I was chasing after in my
years of
addiction was probably some sort of sense of communal connection
or a
connection to a higher thing.
AMY GOODMAN: You write very movingly about Philip
Seymour Hoffman and
also about Robin Williams, both dealing with addiction. Both
died in the last
year.
RUSSELL BRAND: Yes, well, I suppose those high-profile and
sad deaths
provide an opportunity to highlight how many lives are affected
by addiction
and the need to address it by different means. I think
criminalizing and
penalizing people that are ill, like Philip Seymour Hoffman or
Robin Williams,
is sort of pointless. It doesn’t work. People are using more
progressive means
to tackle the issue of addiction, places like Canada and in
Portugal and
Switzerland. I think that the only way for drug addiction to be
correctly
addressed is for it to be regulated, regulated properly, not
left in the hands
of criminals—decriminalized and regulated.
AMY GOODMAN: And overall, the drug war, overall, how
this fits into
that larger story?
RUSSELL BRAND: It’s even just as a piece of language, Amy.
It’s a bit of
an odd thing to say, isn’t it? We’re doing a drug war. Bill
Hicks, the American
comedian, said, "If there is a drug war, and we’re losing it,
that means
drug addicts are winning." That’s really bad to lose a drug war
to people
that are high. So, like, it’s the wrong attitude to have wars on
terror, wars
on drugs. Stop making things worse.
AMY GOODMAN: Well, the amount of money, for example,
that goes into—in
the name of fighting against drugs. Like yesterday, our big
special was on
Mexico—
RUSSELL BRAND: Was it?
AMY GOODMAN: —and these 43 students who disappeared in
the state of
Guerrero. And it turns out that the mayor and the police turned
them over to
drug gangs. And the question is—
RUSSELL BRAND: Good, good.
AMY GOODMAN: —going right up to the president, the
billions of dollars,
for example, the United States has given the Mexican military
and Mexican
police, in the name of the so-called drug war, where has it
really gone? And is
it in fact a real war, but a war against people, particularly
poor people and
indigenous people?
RUSSELL BRAND: Some people would argue, like in that
brilliant film by
Eugene Jarecki, The
House I
Live In, he argues that what’s actually happening is that
the bottom 15
percent of society are no longer needed because of the collapse
of the
manufacturing industry, so it’s a lot better to just criminalize
them and put
them in prison. So, yeah, it’s like it’s a proxy war on poverty.
It’s a proxy
race war. I certainly think that argument holds. I mean, I think
addiction can
affect people from any economic or social background, but those
who tend to
suffer most are those without money. And there’s no doubt that
social conditions
have a huge impact on people’s tendency to get addicted to
substances. I think
if people live in communal environments where they’ve got access
to support
and—forgive me for using the word—love, then they’re less likely
to get
addicted to drugs.
AMY GOODMAN: I want to go to an amazing moment you had
in the U.S.
media onMorning Joe.
RUSSELL BRAND: Do you?
AMY GOODMAN: But before I do that, I want to go to the
Parliament right
here.
RUSSELL BRAND: Do whatever you want.
AMY GOODMAN: This is the Parliament building, where you
recently
testified. You offered testimony on the issue of drugs?
RUSSELL BRAND: Didn’t offer it. They drag you in there, to
go, "Will
you talk to a committee?" And I think the reason they got me in
there was
to draw attention to the fact that they were having a committee
to debate drug
laws. Since then, of course, drug laws have radically changed in
the country.
They haven’t. They’ve done nothing. So, it was like a sort of a
circus, you
know, kangaroo court thing, when they just bring people in
[inaudible].
AMY GOODMAN: So let’s go to Russell Brand in the British
Parliament.
RUSSELL BRAND: It’s more important that we regard people
suffering from
addiction with compassion and that there’s a pragmatic, rather
than symbolic,
approach to treating it. And I think the legislative status of
addiction and
the criminalization of addicts is kind of symbolic, not really
functional. I
don’t see how it especially helps. I’m not saying let’s have a
wacky
free-for-all with people going around taking drugs. Didn’t do
me—didn’t help me
much.
KEITH VAZ: You’re a former heroin addict.
RUSSELL BRAND: Yeah.
KEITH VAZ: Briefly, could you tell us how you got onto
drugs and then
how you managed to come off it, and how many years you were on
hard drugs?
RUSSELL BRAND: I see you’ve incorporated the word
"briefly" now
into the question. As you already know, it’s my propensity for
verbosity.
I
became a drug
addict, I think, because of emotional difficulties,
psychological difficulties,
and perhaps a spiritual malady. For me, taking drugs and
excessive drinking
were the result of a psychological, spiritual or mental
condition, so they’re
symptomatic. I was like sad, lonely, unhappy, detached, and
drugs and alcohol,
for me, seemed like a solution to that problem. Once I dealt
with the
emotional, spiritual, mental impetus, I no longer felt the need
to take drugs
or use drugs.
AMY GOODMAN: So that is Russell Brand testifying before
the Parliament.
And we’re going to go to break—
RUSSELL BRAND: Why?
AMY GOODMAN: —to a music break for a minute. But you
said something
right as we were going into this.
RUSSELL BRAND: Yeah.
AMY GOODMAN: When I said, "Let’s go to Russell Brand in
Parliament," you said, "Get used to it"?
RUSSELL BRAND: "Get used to saying that." I was being
silly.
AMY GOODMAN: No, but are you?
RUSSELL BRAND: What do you mean? Go to Parliament?
AMY GOODMAN: Would you consider running as a member of
Parliament?
Would you consider running?
RUSSELL BRAND: No, I want to help the ordinary people of
America and
Britain dismantle their corrupt political structures and replace
them with
directly responsible, directly democratic organizations. I don’t
want to help
them lot continue to tyrannize people.
AMY GOODMAN: Do you think you could ever do that within
the system, or
do you think it’s much more effective to be outside?
RUSSELL BRAND: Well, I would take the advice of people
that know a lot
more than me—Lawrence Lessig and Naomi Klein, Noam Chomsky. Most
of those
people say that change within the system is prevented,
impossible, futile, that
we need significant systemic change.
AMY GOODMAN: We’re talking to Russell Brand. We’re going
to go to
break, and then we’re back right here in London, as we sit in
front of Big Ben
and MI5. Stay with us.
[break]
AMY GOODMAN: Our guest for the hour is Russell Brand,
who is the
well-known British comedian, actor and now really leading member
of the British
left. Last year—
RUSSELL BRAND: Am I?
AMY GOODMAN: —he edited a issue of the New Statesman.
He spoke at
Occupy Democracy—that’s what an Occupy movement here in Britain
is called, in
London. Tell us about that music.
RUSSELL BRAND: Oh, well, what happened was, is that a
thing started in
our country where people were like saying—in my book, they said
I’m loquacious
and verbose, because I use long words. I love long words. In
fact, I love all
sorts of different words. I like specificity of language. I like
hip-hop. I
like Shakespeare. I like things where people use language well.
So people, I
think, to try and exclude me from the debate, posh people went,
"Well,
when you hear someone with that accent talking and using long
words, one can
imagine 'Parklife' being shouted"—in a reference to a 1994
Britpop anthem
called "Parklife." So I thought, ah, all right, I’ll do this
song.
So, me and these lads, The Rubberbandits, these Irish lads, the
hip-hop group,
did a version of "Parklife" where we refocused on the issues,
issues
such as austerity, decline of public services and the
ineffectiveness of our
current leaders and system.
AMY GOODMAN: Well, your book is getting a lot of
positive reviews. The
New York Times Book Review—
RUSSELL BRAND: And at times being savaged!
AMY GOODMAN: New York Times Book Review said "a relentless ride"—well, no, this was
actually about My
Booky Wook,
your previous book.
RUSSELL BRAND: Yeah, this one, people can’t wade into it
hard enough.
AMY GOODMAN: "A relentless ride...The bloke can write."
And
Dwight Garner ofThe New York Times said,
"I laughed out loud at least a dozen times."
RUSSELL BRAND: "Before I opened it."
AMY GOODMAN: That was—
RUSSELL BRAND: That’s a Groucho Marx joke.
AMY GOODMAN: But I want to go to your moment in American
media—you’ve
had many, but this one was your appearance on MSNBC’s Morning Joe last year, with co-host
Mika
Brzezinski introducing you by saying, quote, "He’s a really big
deal, I’m
told. I’m not very pop-cultured, I’m sorry," and another
co-host—well,
that was Katty Kay, your countrywoman here from Britain—she does BBC in the United
States—Katty Kay
continually referring to you as Willy or Willy Brandt, right,
the former German
chancellor. About six minutes into the interview, the bottom of
the screen
reads, quote, "Russell Brand Takes Over, Dominating the MJ Set."
This
is a clip.
MIKA BRZEZINSKI: OK, Russell Brand—
RUSSELL BRAND: This is what you all do for a living?
MIKA BRZEZINSKI: Yes, yes.
RUSSELL BRAND: OK. But I’m here to—
MIKA BRZEZINSKI: I’m a professional.
RUSSELL BRAND: OK, well, let me help you. I’m here to—
KATTY KAY: Russell.
RUSSELL BRAND: —promote a tour called "Messiah Complex."
It’s
here for the people of America. I want the people of America to
come and see me
do stand-up. Go to RussellBrand.tv, where you can purchase
tickets to see me.
These people, I’m sure, are typically very, very good at their
jobs. What are
you? You’re conveying news to the people of America?
BRIAN SHACTMAN: Yes.
RUSSELL BRAND: People of America, we’re going to be OK.
Everything’s all
right. These are your trusted anchors.
KATTY KAY: [inaudible]
RUSSELL BRAND: Is that news lingo? Here’s your papers.
I’ll shuffle them
for you.
MIKA BRZEZINSKI: Oh, shuffle, shuffle the [inaudible].
RUSSELL BRAND: Give us that.
MIKA BRZEZINSKI: That’s good.
KATTY KAY: Pen. You need a pen, Russell, definitely.
RUSSELL BRAND: OK, coming up later. Thank you very much,
Kat. OK, we’re
going to be talking about the situation with Edward Snowden,
this
whistleblower. Is it good what he’s done for America? Or are our
sectrets being
jeopardized by his intentions? We’re going to be talking about
that.
AMY GOODMAN: And there you have just a moment on Morning Joe.
What happened?
RUSSELL BRAND: Well, what happened was, I went onto the
television, and I
was trying my hardest to be nice, and everyone was rude to me.
So I defended
myself, under the protocols of Britain, by just saying, "Stop
bullying me,
you lot. And also be more professional. If you’re going to
condescend to
someone, don’t condescend from the gutter."
AMY GOODMAN: And you took over the notes?
RUSSELL BRAND: Yeah, oh, yeah, and then sort of just
hosted the show.
AMY GOODMAN: Became a news reader.
RUSSELL BRAND: Yeah, in, I thought, a professional way.
AMY GOODMAN: What do you think of the U.S. media? I
mean, you’re there
a lot.
RUSSELL BRAND: Some of it’s good, because this is U.S.
media, isn’t it?
So this is going well. I’m enjoying this. I don’t even think
that there’s a
national distinction. I think that what there is is media that’s
dominated by
corporate interests, whether it’s in Britain or France or
America. So, like,
when I’ve been there, I went on like—and I’ve been on some
media, and
everyone’s really lovely and friendly and open-minded. But I
think that—I think
it’s a commonly held view, and that is true, that debate is held
within very
narrow parameters, and if you try to stray outside them, you get
into trouble. And
that’s why I think it’s good to do it comedically and
lightheartedly, not to
respect the parameters of debate and not to stay—not to accept
the frame of,
"Oh, well, you can vote for this person, or you can vote for
that person,
but you can’t take money out of politics and have ordinary
people
represented." Look, we can’t just say aloud that we live under a
feudal
system, we live under an oligarchy, and we have no political
purchase. We have
no purchase. We have no impact on power. America and Great
Britain are not run
for ordinary people; it’s run for corporations. But this time is
coming to an
end, so that’s a good thing.
Is it
true your dad
went to summer camp with Chomsky? And if it is true, I bet
Chomsky was boring
on summer camp: "OK, I’m not doing that. That’s childish. No,
come on, sit
down. This summer camp is corrupt. I refuse to abide by this
system, while it’s
quite clear that this summer camp is run by the interests of the
leaders there,
and we, the children, are not given any time to be free." What
about
spring break with Chomsky? "Spring break!" "No, well,
that’s—you’ve revealed there the truth there, the manufacture of
the nipple
consent."
AMY GOODMAN: I actually think Chomsky was pretty playful
at camp.
RUSSELL BRAND: Was he? Playful Chomsky?
AMY GOODMAN: Well, let’s go for a moment to Noam
Chomsky. Let’s go to
Noam Chomsky—
RUSSELL BRAND: Segue.
AMY GOODMAN: —just a couple weeks ago. I had this
interesting
experience of being able to do a public interview with him at
the U.N. General
Assembly.
RUSSELL BRAND: Was it good?
AMY GOODMAN: Eight hundred people packed in—ambassadors,
people from
the public all over the world. And I want to get your comment on
what he has to
say.
AMY GOODMAN: What do you think is the most—the single
most important
action the United States can take? And what about its role over
the years? What
is its interest here?
NOAM CHOMSKY: Well, one important action that the United
States could
take is to live up to its own laws. Of course, it would be nice
if it lived up
to international law, but maybe that’s too much to ask, but live
up to its own
laws. And there are several. And here, incidentally, I have in
mind advice to
activists also, who I think ought to be organizing and educating
in this
direction. There are two crucial cases.
One of
them is what’s
called the Leahy Law. Patrick Leahy, Senator Leahy, introduced
legislation
called the Leahy Law, which bars sending weapons to any military
units which
are involved in consistent human rights violations. There isn’t
the slightest
doubt that the Israeli army is involved in massive human rights
violations,
which means that all dispatch of U.S. arms to Israel is in
violation of U.S.
law. I think that’s significant. The U.S. should be called upon
by its own
citizens to—and by others, to adhere to U.S. law, which also
happens to conform
to international law in this case, as Amnesty International, for
example, for
years has been calling for an arms embargo against Israel for
this reason.
These are all steps that can be taken.
The
second is the
tax-exempt status that is given to organizations in the United
States which are
directly involved in the occupation and in significant attacks
on human and
civil rights within Israel itself, like the Jewish National
Fund. Take a look
at its charter with the state of Israel, which commits it to
acting for the
benefit of people of Jewish race, religion and origin within
Israel. One of the
consequences of that is that by a complex array of laws and
administrative
practices, the fund pretty much administers about 90 percent of
the land of the
country, with real consequences.
AMY GOODMAN: You’ve been listening to Noam Chomsky. He
was speaking at
the U.N. General Assembly before 800 people—ambassadors from
around the world.
It wasn’t the actual meeting of the U.N. General Assembly, but
there were so
many people who came out to see him that they had to move it
into the largest
chamber of the U.N. Our guest today is Russell Brand, who is a
huge fan of Noam
Chomsky.
RUSSELL BRAND: And as good as him at doing political
analysis, I think.
AMY GOODMAN: And you bring him up in Revolution.
RUSSELL BRAND: Yeah, I do. But what’s more important, Amy,
is you just
admitted while that was on that Noam Chomsky bit your father.
AMY GOODMAN: Well, this is an ongoing debate—
RUSSELL BRAND: That’s a good quote. That should be on the New York Post front page.
AMY GOODMAN: —that we are having.
RUSSELL BRAND: "Chomsky bit my father!"
AMY GOODMAN: I’m not clear if it was—we should say—
RUSSELL BRAND: Especially if it’s called "Chompsky."
"Chompsky!"
AMY GOODMAN: They were bunkmates.
RUSSELL BRAND: "Well, there you go."
AMY GOODMAN: I might have confused—
RUSSELL BRAND: Bunkmates? This is getting worse.
AMY GOODMAN: I might have confused—
RUSSELL BRAND: In my country, that means—
AMY GOODMAN: —him biting my father with simply Chomsky’s
biting wit. I
might have gotten confused.
RUSSELL BRAND: Which is exactly how the manufacture of
consent and media
manipulation of information happens, Amy. A real event
concerning Noam Chomsky
happens, and you manipulate it. All of his theories are right.
This is a bit
where I wrote about Noam Chomsky in my book.
AMY GOODMAN: So, read from your chapter—
RUSSELL BRAND: This is the Noam Chomsky bit.
AMY GOODMAN: Yes.
RUSSELL BRAND: Because I love Noam Chomsky. "Chomsky—who
must have
one of the most satisfying names to say in the world, which is
apposite for a
linguist—explains how [the Monroe Doctrine] has been used to
validate U.S.
terror"—no offense, Americans, I don’t mean you, mean your
government, and
our government, too—" domestically and abroad, since 1823. This
is when
the Monroe Doctrine was established. Because you are childish,
you think that
the Monroe Doctrine is a pledge to act all sexy and emphysemic,
lifting up yer
frock, going 'poo-poo-pee-doo.' It ain’t. It was a diplomatic
commitment from a
century and a half ago when the Americans decided that they
intended to
'dominate the hemisphere,' which is an outlandish objective. It
sounds like the
sort of devilish intention that kept the British ...
establishment occupied:
’I’d like to dominate your hemisphere,'“—people say over there,
and I'm using
it as a sexual pun, and I had to drop a bit there, because you
made me promise
not to swear—"they hollered into hospital wards and children’s
homes.
“The
United States
have achieved this domination primarily by scaring us all
witless and starting
wars either explicitly or by proxy, primarily in countries where
they were
really confident they would win.
"I’m
not saying
I’m as clever as Chomsky—that would be mad [...]—but, as is
always the case
with a prefix of this nature, here is something that makes it
seem like [I am
trying to say that."
So
there’s a bit of
it. Like, I use this brilliant essay from Noam Chomsky. I
analyze it and try
and put it in simple language so that people that wouldn’t
normally listen to
Chomsky go, "Oh, yeah, that was a laugh." But now I know that he
savaged your father with his fangs, I think I might scribble it
out with a
crayon.
AMY GOODMAN: I’m sorry, Noam. I’m really sorry—
RUSSELL BRAND: He’s a cannibal!
AMY GOODMAN: —that this got a little out of hand. But,
Russell, in the
headlines today, we talked about the Wal-Mart protesters around
the United
States, people in the Capitol who feed the senators, who just
came back from
break, calling for a $15 minimum wage, and this interesting
study that found
the six heirs to the Wal-Mart fortune make as much as the bottom
79 percent of
black families in the United States combined.
RUSSELL BRAND: That’s a worrying statistic and an
indication that you
can’t claim to be the land of the free when that’s happening,
not when people
have got money just because they emerged from the correct vagina
and having as
much money as 70 percent of—well, what is it?—185 million
Americans, but you’ve
framed it racially, as well. It’s really, really quite worrying.
I think there
is sort of room for some kind of wealth distribution.
AMY GOODMAN: And this week has also been historic in
Mike Brown’s
parents going to Geneva and testifying around the issue of
torture, a whole
issue of police brutality. At any moment now, a decision is
going to be made by
a grand jury over whether the police officer who killed Mike
Brown, Darren
Wilson, will be indicted.
RUSSELL BRAND: It’s unfortunate. It’s a really scary,
terrible incident,
and what’s happening in Ferguson more broadly is frightening.
But what I heard
was that $4.2 billion worth of military equipment have been
transferred to
local police authorities across the United States. So the
militarization of
police forces in your country and in our country is terrifying.
It’s almost
like they’re anticipating further public unrest, and instead of
placating
members of the population through fairness, redistribution of
wealth, not
beating them up and shooting them, they’ve decided to just arm
the police.
"Well, we’re going to have to shoot them a bit, then shoot them
some
more." It’s really sort of frightening. I think what’s happening
in
Ferguson, we’ll be seeing a lot more of that in countries all
over the world, as
this growing disparity between rich and poor, this gulf of
inequality,
continues.
AMY GOODMAN: You know, we have a law, Posse Comitatus,
that says troops
can’t—
RUSSELL BRAND: What? Hakuna matata? That’s from The Lion King.
That’s not a
law. What is it called?
AMY GOODMAN: Troops can’t—Posse Comitatus, that says—
RUSSELL BRAND: Why is it called that in America?
AMY GOODMAN: —troops can’t march through the streets of
the United
States.
RUSSELL BRAND: Hakuna matata?
AMY GOODMAN: And I wonder if the arming of police is a
way of getting
around that.
RUSSELL BRAND: Probably.
AMY GOODMAN: Because you then have police with military
weapons, with
tanks, rolling down the streets of the United States.
RUSSELL BRAND: That’s really worrying. That’s sort of—you
know those
people, survivalists, that live in a mountain with a rifle and
say, "We
want to set up our own society based on camo and eating
squirrels." Makes
you think that they’ve got a point, doesn’t it? You know, if the
government are
trying to find proxy ways to militarize the police force and
march them through
the streets. But my hope comes from the fact that members of the
police force
that I know, in our country and in your country, they’re
ordinary people from
ordinary backgrounds that, somewhere in them, know that they’re
there to
protect and to serve the public, not to be the henchmen of the
establishment.
AMY GOODMAN: I wanted to get your take, since you go
back and forth
between the United States and Britain, on—you talked about the
U.S. midterm
elections. So, now the Republicans are in charge in Senate, and
so, when you
look at the different committees, the new head of the
Environment Committee is
James Inhofe, who is the leading climate change denier. He’s the
head of the
Environment Committee of the Senate. Naomi Klein speaks a lot
about him and
also, of course, in her book, This
Changes
Everything, about the issue of climate change and what we
can do—This
Changes Everything: Capitalism vs. the Climate. You talk
about Naomi Klein
inRevolution. You actually just recently interviewed
her, right?
RUSSELL BRAND: Yes.
AMY GOODMAN: Was it in The
Trews?
RUSSELL BRAND: It was in The
Trews, yeah. She was kind enough to come on, and I read
some of her book,
she read a little bit of mine. And from Naomi Klein, I learned
that capitalism
isn’t going to voluntarily change. Exxon, who have recorded
record profits and
can only $48 billion a year using the practices they currently
do, are not
going to change without a fight. They’re not going to start
saying, "Oh,
well, let’s go into renewable energy. Let’s have a windmill
farm." They
are happy with the things the way they are. It’s only with
creative direct
action, it’s only with the application of pressure from ordinary
people, that
there will be any kind of change.
AMY GOODMAN: Russell, we just have a minute. What gives
you hope?
RUSSELL BRAND: Everything gives me hope, because every—my
hope comes from
the fact that I know that everybody wants change. I know that
people are not
apathetic. I know that people are ready for change. I know that
alternatives
are possible and that you constantly see how hard the
establishment has to work
to maintain order. Look at all these institutions, the banks of
the Thames
lined with institutions to hold ordinary people down. Constantly
through the media,
they try to prevent different arguments emerging. That is
because they know
change is inevitable. Change is just a different story. We,
people in the
media, have an obligation to reframe this argument, to tell
people that they
can change the world, that we are connected to one another. We
have more in
common with each other. We have more in common with the people
we’re bombing
than the people we’re bombing them for. People that say the
system works work
for the system. We can change the world. The revolution can
begin as soon as
you decide it does in yourself, Amy.
AMY GOODMAN: So, there you have it. Russell Brand, his
new book is
calledRevolution.
RUSSELL BRAND: And Noam Chomsky is a cannibal.
AMY GOODMAN: That does it for our show, and I want to
thank all the
folks who have made this broadcast possible. Special thanks to
Mike Burke and
Renée Feltz and Nermeen Shaikh and Aaron Maté and Steve
Martinez, Sam Alcoff,
Hany Massoud, Robby Karran, Deena Guzder, Amy Littlefield, Julie
Crosby, Becca
Staley, Denis Moynihan.
RUSSELL BRAND: No, he was terrible.
AMY GOODMAN: This is Democracy
Now!, democracynow.org, The
War and Peace Report.
RUSSELL BRAND: Denis was useless.
AMY GOODMAN: I’m Amy Goodman. Thanks so much for joining
us.
RUSSELL BRAND: Denis should be ashamed.
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